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#94377 - 09/21/05 05:38 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Snare02]
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Registered: 01/13/03
Loc: Iowa City, IA
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I posted something on cavaliers.org, and Paul replied with this. I don't agree with cutting the snares down so there are only eight. Otherwise, it is pretty straightforward.
1. Tuning Your Marching Snare Drum
This short document is a step-by-step how-to guide on successfully tuning a Yamaha sFz snare drum. First, we must define the type of sound that is desired in our performing and practicing situations. Next, we must discuss top and bottom head changing and general care, and individual snare tuning.
Sound
The most important word to consider when tuning a snare line in an advanced, contemporary field percussion ensemble, is "short". It is important to see that "high" doesn't necessarily mean "short". Therefore, it is important to check other aspects of tuning the snare drum that doesn't necessarily involve the drum heads themselves. The snare sound should be crisp and articulate, with little or no after-ring.
The Bottom Head
The bottom head, or "snare-side head" should often be tuned first; it is often the bottom head that determined the "shortness" of a drum's sound. Here are the steps to changing and tuning a snare-side head:
1. Take the old head off and throw it away. Check to see if any tension rods (lugs) are bent, or washers are missing. Check tension rods by placing on the ground and rolling; if there is a "wobble", they need to be replaced. Do not take the tension rods from the rim, unless they are bent. When replacing a tension rod, dip about 1/8th of an inch of the new rod into Vaseline, and then place it back into rim.
2. Take a clear plastic bottom head, and spread paraffin wax (used on surf boards and for canning veggies) in great amounts along the inside of the head's metal hoop. Continue further inside, for the head will definitely stretch a great deal.
3. After you are sure all tension rods and washers are in good shape, take the rim off (with washers still hanging) and place the new, clear plastic head on the bearing edge. Place the rim back on the drum, and tighten the tension rods lightly until you can no longer move them with your fingers.
4. This step is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT: make sure that the head is on the bearing edge evenly, this means that there is the same amount of space between the bearing edge and the rim all the way around.
5. Tighten each tension rod with a spin key about one quarter turn, starting on the tension rod (lug) immediately to the left of front center (about 7 o'clock) and goi8ng around in a clockwise manner. This will be referred to as the "reference lug". Then check the spacing of the rim and the bearing edge again. Check the rim to avoid any "roller coaster" (rippled heads) effects early on. If you neglect this step, the head will already be unbalanced; this significantly shortens its life and allows only about half of its full cranking (tuning) capacity.
6. After complete evenness is achieved, begin on the reference lug, and tighten in 180 degree increments (half turns), But continue ACROSS THE DRUM rather than around. Be careful to keep track of where you are! Continue for about 3 revolutions about the rim, then wait a few minutes for the head to stretch. Then continuing again, in the same increments, until the pitch is high enough that its sound blends with the top head's sound. Of course, it won't be as tight, but it shouldn't be significantly lower.
7. Before each rehearsal or performance, tighten the head CLOCKWISE in 1/8-1/4 turns all the way around, being sure always to start with the reference lug and end with the one before it.
8. Be careful not to base your tuning entirely on feel. Always be looking at the rim to avoid unevenness.
9. Above all, keep tuning your bottom head. This head is always changing, especially with climactic inconsistencies. If the drum sounds bad, check the bottom head. But if it sounds great, leave it alone=)
The Top Head
We use Premier Tendura brand top heads, which are made of an extremely durable and bullet proof material called "KevlarŪ." These heads are strong enough that without proper care while tuning, significant damage can be done to the free floating top unit of the sFz. This damage comes in the form of "egging" (ovaling of the rim). Once a top unit is "egged", a new head will no longer fit its dimensions. Here are the steps in tuning a top head:
1. Follow step one, for bottom head tuning.
2. Paraffin wax is applied, but rather than to the head itself, apply a healthy amount to the metal bearing edge.
3. Follow step 3, above, except be sure that you put the rim back on in the same spot that it was before. To facilitate this, place one tape marker on the rim, and one on the top unit, to signal the correct tension rod placement when the new head is placed on the bearing edge.
4. Follow step 4 as above.
5. Starting with the reference lug, tune the top head in the same way as you would tune the bottom head, checking for evenness, etc, except continue to go around the drum, not across. Also, with Tendura heads, it is best to tune them as much at first as possible. In other words, try to make the drum sound high in pitch right away. Once a Tendura settles, it is hard to tune it up again to maximum crispness.
6. Often, if a Tendura has been exposed to unsuitable weather conditions (primarily wetness), it will become "dead" sounding after a number of days. It is recommended simply to change a head such as this, as it will never sound good again.
Tuning the Snares
Often a "wet" sounding snare drum is the result of poorly tuned snares. If the snares are too lose, they sound wet, or long. If they are too tight, they sound choked off, and cause the drum to ring significantly. If one is having trouble getting the drum to sound short, it is helpful to check the snare tuning. Tune the snare in the following way.
1. Obtain a very small flathead screwdriver, and two pencils or pens.
2. Turn the drum over, and throw off the snares (the snare throwoff device is opposite the snare tuning screws).
3. Place a pencil approximately three inches inside the rim, under the snares to suspend the snares for tuning, then throw the snares back on.
4. Plucking the long parts of the snares should give a distinct pitch to each one, like playing a guitar or harp. Starting with the outside snare, tighten or loosen the twelve screws until the pitch is uniform among all snares. Go for a high pitched sound, that resonates well.
5. Keep in mind that once you have tightened one, tightening others will affect the pitch of that one. It is impossible to get all of the snares exactly the same pitch. If they are relatively tight, and are nearly the same pitch, the snare sound should be crisp.
6. If the drum sounds choked off or ringy after tuning the snares, you may have gone too far. Loosen them up a bit, still focusing on a distinct pitch.
7. Also, usually these snares come from the factory with 12 or more snare. We will generally cut off four of these, so that each snare has eight snares. Often too much snare sound results in the "fat" or "long" sound that we so detest.
Paul Milano
FMM 70-74
Although (making this longer), I don't know why it doesn't say to tune to a certain pitch. Because the heads are ever changing (bottom heads)?
_________________________
Jeff "Gonzo" Gonzalez
HHS Drumline '99-'03
Vinton HS Percussion Instructor/Arranger '04-present
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#94378 - 09/24/05 02:14 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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Registered: 03/22/04
Loc: St. Louis/Springfield, MO
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Quote:
I posted something on cavaliers.org, and Paul replied with this. I don't agree with cutting the snares down so there are only eight. Otherwise, it is pretty straightforward.
Depends on what size line and how much sound quality they play with. Here at Missouri State we cut off four guts (SFZ snares, by the way), tape them, and then pad them (folded paper towel taped to the underside of the drum) to get the sound we want, and that's with only 7 snares -- and the snare sound still comes across as "thick" sometimes.
Quote:
Although (making this longer), I don't know why it doesn't say to tune to a certain pitch. Because the heads are ever changing (bottom heads)?
Depends on where you are... sometime's its good do the first tune to a definite pitch, and then relative tune every subsequent time you tune the drum. In places with high humidity variation (like the Midwest) or a lot of traveling with variations in humidity, the pitch won't remain constant for long periods of time anyway so you're better off relatively tuning each drum to each other than always tuning to a definite pitch.
_________________________
missouri state university - snare 05,06
phi mu alpha sinfonia, iota rho - spring 06
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#94382 - 10/18/05 04:31 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: ]
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Registered: 07/14/04
Loc: Boise, ID
Post's Karma Value: 20
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Drum: Premier HTS 780
Top Head: Evans MX White
Bottom Head: Evans MS3 Clear
When Replacing both heads:
After removing and tossing (or giving them out, whatever) both heads, be sure to inspect the rims, shell, and cage for any signs of wear or damage, fix anything that needs fixing, and make a note of everything else. Replace the shell in the cage, making sure to line the badges and stickers up right (doesn't affect the playing, but just looks better). Clean the bearing edge on the bottom of the shell with a DAMP (not WET) paper towel or clean rag. make sure all moisture is removed after this step.
Place the bottom head on the bearing edge making sure it's even, and stays even throughout the process. tighten the lugs finger tight, greasing all of them with petrol. jelly. After finger tightening, use a key to tighten the head to the desired pitch. Usually at MHS, we just tune the heads until they sound good, not to a specific pitch. We use too many key changes in a show to even bother trying to tune our snares like tympani.
When tuning the guts, a specific pitch again isn't looked for, just a feel of what sounds good. Slide a pencil under one end of the guts and turn the snares on. Pluck the snares like guitar strings to find your pitch, picking the one you like and tuning the rest to that.
Replacing the top head follows much the same procedure, however instead of criss-cross tuning, tune in a circle once the lugs are finger tight. Again, no specific pitch is necessary, simply tune the heads to a good pitch. Put the drum on a pillow when tuning, in order to dampen the bottom head and the snares.
If desired, tape guts with one strip of stick tape in the center of the bottom head, or two, evenly spaced strips.
_________________________
Colts 00-02
Boise State 08-now
With a few teaching stops in between.
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#94383 - 12/02/05 09:17 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Jon]
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Registered: 09/27/04
Loc: Massachusetts
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Drum:14" Yamaha sfz
Batter Head:Remo White Max
Snare Head:Remo Ambassador Clear (Mylar)
1.Remove both heads, clean the drum side of the top rim, and and the entire top rim itself. Clean all the dust away from the bearing edge on the bottom side as well.
2.Finger-tighten the top head as you do, and tighten it only enough (using the cross patterns of course) until the overtones and ringing goes away, then let it sit for a while.
3. Then put on the bottom head, since there is no collar, it needs to have time to stretch so it can't be tightened up too fast or it can stretch or even break. Finger tighten the bottom head as much as you can, then turn the key 4 times around on each lug (cross pattern again).
4. Next, take the top head and turn it between 6 and 8 times around on each lug. You might hear little pops and cracks from the head, it's just seating in, don't worry. check after every couple turns to make sure the head is seating evenly. I usually take a ruler and stick it on the bearing edge and make sure all of them are even. It's very easy for the head to not seat properly at this stage, so this is important.
5. Take the bottom head, and start to crank each lug up about 2 times for each lug. Take your time with these turns, don't turn too quick because you can seriously damnage the head now. Use the ruler again and check the bearing edges every couple turns. You will probably hear popping now too, but again, it's just the head seating. Do this until you reach the desired pitch you want.
6.Now to the top head again, set the entire drum down on a towel so you mute the bottom head, tune the top head to the desired pitch you want, while stick checking the lugs now and again with the ruler.
7. Now you're ready to tune the guts, unlike what Jon said, don't put the pen in and turn the guts on. Keep the guts off. But still put a pen or pencil under the guts. To do this, turn the guts off, slide the pen under the open side of the guts, and slide it to the other end, where the guts should stil be touching the head, I recommend that you put a paper towel between the pen and the head, so you don't scratch the head. I didn't remember to do that with mine and now there is ugly scratches on the head. WHen you push the pen all the way back, you can now tune the guts. Tune them all to the same pitch, I advise you to NOT tune them incredibly high because over time, the guts stretch and then they are no good after stretched too far. Tune all the guts the same, then slide the pen back to the other side, turn the snares on, make sure each end of the snares is touching the head with the same amount of force. The level of each side can be altered using the round things on top of each mechanism on the sides. Make sure those are leveled right, turn the guts on, play.
For a wet sound loosen the entire gut mechanism a little more (on the left snare mechanism, from drivers standpoint)
For a dry sound, tigthen the same mechanism to your desire. Be aware that overtightening this over time will stretch the guts, thus making them unusable after a few years. That happened at my high school, all the guts are stretched too far and now we can't tighten them as much as we would like.
_________________________
Denver Broncos for life.
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#94384 - 05/11/06 12:57 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: SamuraiX864]
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Registered: 08/29/04
Loc: michigan
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Yamaha 13" sfz BOTTOM HEAD 1.) rub wax on the bottom edge of the shell where the head sits (helps the rim from catching a sharp edge and ripping.) 2.) place remo ambassador head on bottom ( you know the paper thin heads) 3.) place rim on drum. 4.) dip lugs in vasaline (or whatever lube you want) and place then and screw them on finger tight. 5.) start krankin the head down in criss-cross pattern starting with 3 turns/ lug then decrease the next set until it gets close to the tension you want. ( you cant over krank especially with the paper thin head.) soooo let it sit to stretch a bit then continue until it gets to the tension you want There is no real pitch just whatever we think sounds good TOP HEAD. 1.) place top head on drum (remo white max) 2.) place rim over top head 3.) dip lugs in lube and start screwing them in finger tight 4.) same criss cross pattern as the bottom crank the sucker down until you get it where you want it. 5.) let the drum sit play on it a while give the heads a chance to sink into the drum. 6.) finishing touches to the sound you want. Lastly we stick a piece of tape dead center bottom head over the guts. depending on the tension give a nice staccato hope you dont tick sound.
_________________________
Pistons Drumline Snare 2009-present
WMHS Snare Tech 2005-present
Motor City Perc. Snare 2003-2007
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#94385 - 06/05/06 05:25 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: ]
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Registered: 12/29/05
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The basics apply to pretty much any marching snare, but there are some different pitch characteristics for different heads -- particularly KevlarŪ or other high-tension heads versus mylar.
And if you've got a non-free-floating Field-Corps drum, the mylar vs. KevlarŪ topic is one you'll need to pay attention to. With very few exceptions, non-floaters generally weren't designed to handle the high tension of fiber heads like Falams, Tenduras, Maxes, etc. Unless you want to risk damaging the drum, it's a good idea to stick with mylar heads.
First, make sure the snares are aligned with the shell correctly, so they're laying across the snare bed. The snare bed is a small flattened spot on the bottom edge of the shell where the guts are supposed to lie. On a free-floating drum, if you rotate the shell when you reassemble the drum, the guts don't contact the shell & bottom head in the right place and your snare response won't be right.
If you've got the shell lined up right, it's probably just a matter of tuning and adjusting the guts, which seems to get overlooked by most people.
First, tune the guts themselves like snare02 mentioned in steps 7-9 of the fourth post in this thread. While it's ideal to match the pitch from strand to strand like he described, I can usually get a fairly decent sound in less time by making sure all the strands are roughly the same tension. Set the tension knob to the point where some strands are pulled straight while others are loose. Add just enough tension to straighten the loose ones. Readjust the knob and repeat until you've got all the guts in the same ballpark.
Next, set the vertical adjustments on the snare assembly to make sure the snares touch the head the whole way across. If the snare assembly is adjusted too low, there will be some gap between the snares and the bottom head, greatly reducing your snare response. If the snare assembly is too high, the snares will bend as they contact the bearing edge. That bend actually acts as a lever and pushes the snares away from the head. You want the snare strands to be almost perfectly straight from one end to the other.
Finally, adjust the tension of the snare strainer. As a baseline, I disengage the snare throw-off and adjust the tension knob so that there's just barely enough tension to hold all the guts perfectly straight. Re-engage the snare and fine-tune by ear. (It helps a lot to do this part outdoors with another person standing some distance from the drum.)
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#94391 - 10/18/06 04:31 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: i_like_tenors]
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Anonymous
User has negative Karma.
![Tenure]()
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Quote:
I've read all the posts about tuning methods, of which I'm familiar..but I have a query about the actual sound of the drum. I really like the Cadets snare sound..very crisp with a good amount snare.....but despite my efforts, I've been unable to mimick that quality of sound. I can tune a snare pretty well and my lines get compliments on snare sound, but I really wanna get a more crisp sound. I'm a tenor player so I haven't been exposed to many nuances of the snare tuning technique. Any corps guys/snare guru's have any recommendations or advice they could lend?
The cadets get most of their snare sound because of the stick they use. VicFirth Tom Augnst sigs, you'll get little tone with a lot of snare response.
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#94411 - 10/02/07 10:22 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: SFZ541]
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Registered: 12/29/05
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Quote:
Could someone explain how to take the snares off...
On most snare drums, including your Yamahas, disengage the snare throwoff and simply loosen the snare tension adjustment knob until the thing is completely unscrewed. Then slide the guts through the butt end of the strainer.
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#94412 - 10/08/07 10:12 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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Registered: 05/15/07
Loc: Ontario, California
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Pearl FFX1412 Black Max/Hazy Ambassador my procedure is as follows, remove the bottom head and then the top head. dispose or donate or whatever you wanna do to your old ones. then i remove the snare feet from the bottom rim and i dip each lug in a little vaseline or lithium grease, whichever i have handy i put on the bottom head and tighten all the lugs down as tight as i can get them with just my fingers. then i use my hand to put firm pressure downward on the center of the head, it should go down quite a bit and identify any lugs that are too high, which you can loosen untill they are at a similar level as their neighbors. this ensures that your head is centered and all the lugs are even before you start cranking. i turn each lug about 2 full turns going in a criss cross pattern. i balance each lug and then tighten in criss cross one more time. i attempt to balance the head as best as i can at this stage, but it is wise to wait for the head to stretch a bit before doing this. if i press down on the center of the head right now it still has a lot of give (note, if my head is tuned where i like it, smacking it at the very edge with my finger produces a timbale like sound) the batter head is a little more mysterious to me. what i find works well is to make sure that the bottom head wont make any noise (put the drum on a towel) and then go through the same steps as i did for the bottom head. but afterwards, i tighten in a circular pattern untill my forearms burn ( Im using a tiny drumkit key). and balance afterwards. this leaves the head producing a full sound free of overtones in the center and an annoying ping on the edges. now for the snare guts, i make sure they are straight across the head and i loosen them untill i can hit the bottom head and i cant hear it ring anymore. doing all this i have ended up with a snare that really sounds like what i hear in my head when i think 'snare drum,' a dark cracking sound. using a mylar bottom, i need to rebalance the head every few days or so.
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#94414 - 01/07/08 04:31 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gen]
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Registered: 01/06/08
Loc: Oregon
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I use a pearl fxx (14 inch)with a remo cybermax batter head and a falam II snare side head. I crank the cybermax, which are basically a newer version of the tenduras, to a super high pitch. I don't pick a specific pitch because in marching applications, its is easier to keep in tune relative to each other than to a specific pitch (for snares) and depending on head setup the pitch can change every once in a while. I tune the snare side falams to a little lower pitch, again no specific pitch. An important factor in tuning and sound are the snare guts. I found that depending on its contact and tension on the bottom head the sound can be varied a lot ( I'm talking about sound in the dry range since I'm using KevlarŪ heads). For me, having the guts at a low tension worked the best for the sound i wanted, a short stacatto note with crisp snare response, because it gave more snare responce from the falam head than a high tension gut. When tensioning individual guts one should keep in mind to tune the first gut lower than the desired pitch and work up on pitch when you move up on guts to get all the guts at the desired pitch, because tuning one gut changes the pitch of every other strand of gut ( I hope you see my logic ). Also you can always cut some guts if you can't get that dry sound you are looking for, but once gone you can't get them back on so be sure about what you are doing. Anyways, thats how i tune my snare and i think almost everything i said has been repeated somewhere else on this forum, so i give those people credit for what i am spitting out on this forum.
Edited by mastro411 (01/07/08 05:17 AM)
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#160401 - 04/14/08 09:59 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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Registered: 04/14/08
Loc: Florida , United States
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Hey man my name is Livi and ill try and explan this in extreme detail.(This is my level of experteace) Ok man, First you wanna get your drum keys ready. If you can get one drumset key and a marching snare key you are in good shape. But you need to have your snare key. they are cheap as crapp and cost mabey like 4 bucs at your local music store. (In case you were wondering) The drumset key is small and compact. The Marching snare key or T handle (Popular for its Handle as a big capital T)Makes your life 10 times easyer by letting you crank those kevlars nice. Step One: After finger tightning your screws get your drumset key and and turn them at 90 degree angles. Repeat with bottom head. Keep tightning until you hear an annoying *Crack Crack* sound. keep going with your drumset key until tuning gets inbarible. leave it to strech for 45min to 1 hour.(repeat if nesserary) Step Two: After streching make sure you check and see if the screws are still tight. Here is the hard part, Now grab your marching snare key and turn your key at 90 degrees again IMPORTANT Tune in a star fashion. Start at bottom screw, tune then go directly up, tune go one screw to the left, tune then go back to the bottom screw dont TUNE AGAIN YET!! now at the bottom screw go one screw to the right so its making a straight line from the last screw you just tuned. and so on and so forth.(This will make your head sound absolutley gorgous.)every once in a while hit the drum so u can hear its sounding better. when the top head sounds decent swich to bottom head and repeat be very slow this can break on you from tuning to hard. Step 3:Here is the fine tuning. If i were you i would leave it for a while again just to be safe,But you may continue. Repeat the star fasion tuning but tune in smaller degrees like mabey 50 or so. get a drumstick(Preferbly a marching snare stick) and first hit the middle of the head. contune tuning till the head sounds nice and high and u like the sound.Now take your stick and lightly tap the very edge of the head. If you hear a difrence in sound fix it.(this can take a while lol) when the sides are leveled of well hit the center again and the top head should sound really nice. if not keep fine tuning and be careful you dont want to rip it. Step 4: Your top head is tuned congratulations! now repeat with bottom head DO NOT TUNE TO HIGH!! Tune slowly and hit the the drum so you notice the diffrence. When you feel comfortabe with the sound take you thumb and press the center down a bit and hit the sides of the bottom drum and level them out. Last Part! Step 5: You wanna tighten or lossen the cat intestine( thats what they were made out of back in the day lol) the material which gives the snare the popular buzz sound. go to the side and loosen all the way so it sound like you turned the snare off. now slowly tun the knob and u will hear a snare sound come slowly. keep hitting your drum while you are turning the knob. when it sounds perfect you have completed the tuning prosses my friend. Give your drum a hit and it should sound orgazmic lol hope i helped man. Good luck!!
_________________________
It Is what it is... Livi McLizzle
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#162439 - 05/16/08 10:01 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: cshendude]
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Registered: 04/24/08
Loc: Florida
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i know this is kind of random but i notised that alot of lines with the blackmax heads will put the remo crown (or logo for any other head) closest to them. is that so that the logo will not smear all over the drum when played on alot or is that just preference. and also i am purchhasing a new marching snare (yamaha sfz) and i was wondering what a good head combo would be to compliment that drum. thx
_________________________
STRYKE Percussion - 12
UCF Drumline - 11
Coral Glades Indoor - 09-11
Coral Springs HS - 07-11
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#164146 - 06/03/08 09:04 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Jon]
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Registered: 05/04/08
Loc: Florida
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Disclaimer... This is not my response, but Bret Kuhn's. I'm not Bret Kuhn (wish I was) but this is what he had to say from http://www.remo.com/portal/pages/drumming/product_tips/Ask+The+Experts2.html
"QUESTION: This question is for Bret Kuhn.
I think that the concert bass drum sound of the Cavaliers is the best of any I have ever heard. I just love it! What size drums, head type and tuning scheme do you employ to get that fantastic sound? Also what tuning schemes do you employ in the battery? Do you tune to specific pitches or just relative intervals?
Thank You
Matt
BRET'S REPLY:
Hey Matt,
Thanks for asking about the tuning scheme for the concert bass drums and the battery. We do have specific pitches for tuning all of the membrane instruments. The concert bass drums are 40" and are tuned to a C#, the batter head is a Fiberskyn III and the resonant side is white plastic. Often times people tune the concert basses too low and they don't resonate properly. As far as the battery goes, here is the tuning scheme for this past year. The snare tops are white max and tuned to an A and the bottoms are the 3-mil thin plastic/clear (SA-0314-TD) and they were tuned to a D#. With the tenors we used Suede Emperor Crimplock on everything except the shots and there we used the clear Emperors. The pitches are as follows- 14"-B, 13"-D#, 12"-F#, 10"-A, and for the two 6" shots the low was a B and the high was a D#. The bass drums used Ambassadors (BR-12XX-MP) for heads and were tune in perfect 4th's. 32"-D#, 28"-G#, 24"-C#, 20"-F#, 16#-B. We really strive to create a sonority with all of the battery voices and tuning changes from year to year depending on the musical needs of the group. I hope this helps and gets you thinking about what you want to hear from your drums.
Take care,
Bret Kuhn
Percussion Arranger Cavaliers Drum and Bugle Corps."
Also check the link up top out he's got a lot of great stuff about marching drums. Real interesting stuff.
Edited by SnareFlare (06/03/08 09:08 PM)
_________________________
06-07 Southeast High School 2nd Snare
07-08 Southeast High School Snare Captain
08-09 Lakewood Ranch HS 2nd Snare
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#186022 - 04/16/09 12:16 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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User has negative Karma.
Registered: 04/08/09
Loc: Hawaii
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Hey everyone, All the info. You guys are putting up is definately helping me out alot. I need some help with some of the terms used to define different sounds. Can some one explain to me what some of these terms mean. -Brighter sound quality / tone -Warmer sound quality / tone -Darker sound quality / tone -Edgy tone -Firmer feel -Softer feel -Enhanced projection -Attack -Wide attack -Sharp attack -Dry attack -Dry tone I know it's a long list of things but if some one could explain to me what these terms mean, it would be truly appreciated. Thanks, Javier
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#186028 - 04/16/09 04:13 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Javier]
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Registered: 06/11/08
Loc: U.S.
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Most of them mean what they sound like.
-A bright sound is high-pitched and sharp. Sounds that are described as "warm" have a sound that is full across the spectrum, and are a bit less "bright." Dark is, of course, the opposite of bright. Think of cymbals being bright sounds, bass drums being dark sounds, and then think of how the difference applies to snare drum tuning.
-I guess an edgy tone is one that is cutting, and stands out a lot to your ears. That is, lots of high-end response.
-Firm/soft feel is self-explanatory, I think. A drum that has a firm feel will not have as much give as a drum with a soft feel, to your sticks and your hands.
-Projection is how well the drum can be heard, particularly from the audience perspective. A drum with good projection can easily be clearly heard from long distances, like for instance across a football field.
-Attack is the initial "hit" of the note; the beginning of the sound. In other words, the sound that occurs the instant you hit the drum. Wide attack means a longer, bigger sound; sharp attack means a more defined, short sound. An example of a wide attack would be playing a large timpani with a soft mallet, while a sharp attack would be like the sound a spock drum produces.
-Dry attack and tone mean the sound is not very resonant or warm, and may be a bit choked off or muffled.
Edited by PenniesForSale (04/16/09 04:16 AM)
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#188279 - 05/22/09 07:09 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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User has negative Karma.
Registered: 04/08/09
Loc: Hawaii
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Update:
Just a little more info for whoever wants it...the BD that I work for showed me how he tunes his drums. He went to a couple Blue Devils clinics to learn what he knows. The batter head is tuned to a D, and the bottom head to a B (minor thirds, top head higher). Guts to a low pitch, so they don't get overtightened. The snares on my line are slightly bowed on either side, not just resting on the bottom head, to get a little more response. The guts are tightened just enough to get a response from the batter (top) head, maybe a little more but not overtightened. The BD is 51, and he's been a teacher for 17 years. I have to say for him not being a drummer, he has an excellent way of tuning drums. I hope this helps you guys out. Yeah really like the way blue devils snares sound. Can someone clarify what a minor 3rd is. So for the bottom head it's a B right and then you go up 3 halfsteps?... I think. So then it's C Flat, then it's C, then it's D Flat. Are those the 3 halfsteps? Then D is the pitch for the top head. Right? Any way basically the top will be a little higher than the bottom in the end.
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#188288 - 05/22/09 10:07 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Javier]
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Registered: 12/29/05
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The snares on my line are slightly bowed on either side, not just resting on the bottom head, to get a little more response. If the guts are bending as they cross the bearing edge, it actually reduces snare response since it pushes the guts away from the head. Think of it like a see-saw, with the bearing edge being the fulcrum. If you push one side down, the other gets pushed up. (If you look really closely as you tune your snare guts, you can observe this.) Can someone clarify what a minor 3rd is. A minor third is an interval of three semitones (half-steps). For example, C to Eb is a minor third. From C, one half step up would be C#. Two half steps would get you to D. Three half steps and you're at D#, aka Eb. So for the bottom head it's a B right and then you go up 3 halfsteps?... I think. So then it's C Flat, then it's C, then it's D Flat. If you look at a keyboard instrument, you'll notice there's no accidental between B and C, so "C flat" is B natural. Starting at B natural, going up one half step gets you to C natural. Two half steps gets you to C#. Three half steps and you're at D natural.
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#188298 - 05/22/09 05:48 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Javier]
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User has negative Karma.
Registered: 04/08/09
Loc: Hawaii
Post's Karma Value: -5
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Update:
Just a little more info for whoever wants it...the BD that I work for showed me how he tunes his drums. He went to a couple Blue Devils clinics to learn what he knows. The batter head is tuned to a D, and the bottom head to a B (minor thirds, top head higher). Guts to a low pitch, so they don't get overtightened. The snares on my line are slightly bowed on either side, not just resting on the bottom head, to get a little more response. The guts are tightened just enough to get a response from the batter (top) head, maybe a little more but not overtightened. The BD is 51, and he's been a teacher for 17 years. I have to say for him not being a drummer, he has an excellent way of tuning drums. I hope this helps you guys out. Yeah really like the way blue devils snares sound. Can someone clarify what a minor 3rd is. So for the bottom head it's a B right and then you go up 3 halfsteps?... I think. So then it's C Flat, then it's C, then it's D Flat. Are those the 3 halfsteps? Then D is the pitch for the top head. Right? Any way basically the top will be a little higher than the bottom in the end. When you say you tune the bottom head to a B, is that the dead center of the head or each individual lug?
Edited by Javier (05/22/09 05:49 PM)
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#188588 - 05/27/09 10:48 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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User has negative Karma.
Registered: 04/08/09
Loc: Hawaii
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I posted something on cavaliers.org, and Paul replied with this. I don't agree with cutting the snares down so there are only eight. Otherwise, it is pretty straightforward.
1. Tuning Your Marching Snare Drum
This short document is a step-by-step how-to guide on successfully tuning a Yamaha sFz snare drum. First, we must define the type of sound that is desired in our performing and practicing situations. Next, we must discuss top and bottom head changing and general care, and individual snare tuning.
Sound
The most important word to consider when tuning a snare line in an advanced, contemporary field percussion ensemble, is "short". It is important to see that "high" doesn't necessarily mean "short". Therefore, it is important to check other aspects of tuning the snare drum that doesn't necessarily involve the drum heads themselves. The snare sound should be crisp and articulate, with little or no after-ring.
The Bottom Head
The bottom head, or "snare-side head" should often be tuned first; it is often the bottom head that determined the "shortness" of a drum's sound. Here are the steps to changing and tuning a snare-side head:
1. Take the old head off and throw it away. Check to see if any tension rods (lugs) are bent, or washers are missing. Check tension rods by placing on the ground and rolling; if there is a "wobble", they need to be replaced. Do not take the tension rods from the rim, unless they are bent. When replacing a tension rod, dip about 1/8th of an inch of the new rod into Vaseline, and then place it back into rim.
2. Take a clear plastic bottom head, and spread paraffin wax (used on surf boards and for canning veggies) in great amounts along the inside of the head's metal hoop. Continue further inside, for the head will definitely stretch a great deal.
3. After you are sure all tension rods and washers are in good shape, take the rim off (with washers still hanging) and place the new, clear plastic head on the bearing edge. Place the rim back on the drum, and tighten the tension rods lightly until you can no longer move them with your fingers.
4. This step is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT: make sure that the head is on the bearing edge evenly, this means that there is the same amount of space between the bearing edge and the rim all the way around.
5. Tighten each tension rod with a spin key about one quarter turn, starting on the tension rod (lug) immediately to the left of front center (about 7 o'clock) and goi8ng around in a clockwise manner. This will be referred to as the "reference lug". Then check the spacing of the rim and the bearing edge again. Check the rim to avoid any "roller coaster" (rippled heads) effects early on. If you neglect this step, the head will already be unbalanced; this significantly shortens its life and allows only about half of its full cranking (tuning) capacity.
6. After complete evenness is achieved, begin on the reference lug, and tighten in 180 degree increments (half turns), But continue ACROSS THE DRUM rather than around. Be careful to keep track of where you are! Continue for about 3 revolutions about the rim, then wait a few minutes for the head to stretch. Then continuing again, in the same increments, until the pitch is high enough that its sound blends with the top head's sound. Of course, it won't be as tight, but it shouldn't be significantly lower.
7. Before each rehearsal or performance, tighten the head CLOCKWISE in 1/8-1/4 turns all the way around, being sure always to start with the reference lug and end with the one before it.
8. Be careful not to base your tuning entirely on feel. Always be looking at the rim to avoid unevenness.
9. Above all, keep tuning your bottom head. This head is always changing, especially with climactic inconsistencies. If the drum sounds bad, check the bottom head. But if it sounds great, leave it alone=)
The Top Head
We use Premier Tendura brand top heads, which are made of an extremely durable and bullet proof material called "KevlarŪ." These heads are strong enough that without proper care while tuning, significant damage can be done to the free floating top unit of the sFz. This damage comes in the form of "egging" (ovaling of the rim). Once a top unit is "egged", a new head will no longer fit its dimensions. Here are the steps in tuning a top head:
1. Follow step one, for bottom head tuning.
2. Paraffin wax is applied, but rather than to the head itself, apply a healthy amount to the metal bearing edge.
3. Follow step 3, above, except be sure that you put the rim back on in the same spot that it was before. To facilitate this, place one tape marker on the rim, and one on the top unit, to signal the correct tension rod placement when the new head is placed on the bearing edge.
4. Follow step 4 as above.
5. Starting with the reference lug, tune the top head in the same way as you would tune the bottom head, checking for evenness, etc, except continue to go around the drum, not across. Also, with Tendura heads, it is best to tune them as much at first as possible. In other words, try to make the drum sound high in pitch right away. Once a Tendura settles, it is hard to tune it up again to maximum crispness.
6. Often, if a Tendura has been exposed to unsuitable weather conditions (primarily wetness), it will become "dead" sounding after a number of days. It is recommended simply to change a head such as this, as it will never sound good again.
Tuning the Snares
Often a "wet" sounding snare drum is the result of poorly tuned snares. If the snares are too lose, they sound wet, or long. If they are too tight, they sound choked off, and cause the drum to ring significantly. If one is having trouble getting the drum to sound short, it is helpful to check the snare tuning. Tune the snare in the following way.
1. Obtain a very small flathead screwdriver, and two pencils or pens.
2. Turn the drum over, and throw off the snares (the snare throwoff device is opposite the snare tuning screws).
3. Place a pencil approximately three inches inside the rim, under the snares to suspend the snares for tuning, then throw the snares back on.
4. Plucking the long parts of the snares should give a distinct pitch to each one, like playing a guitar or harp. Starting with the outside snare, tighten or loosen the twelve screws until the pitch is uniform among all snares. Go for a high pitched sound, that resonates well.
5. Keep in mind that once you have tightened one, tightening others will affect the pitch of that one. It is impossible to get all of the snares exactly the same pitch. If they are relatively tight, and are nearly the same pitch, the snare sound should be crisp.
6. If the drum sounds choked off or ringy after tuning the snares, you may have gone too far. Loosen them up a bit, still focusing on a distinct pitch.
7. Also, usually these snares come from the factory with 12 or more snare. We will generally cut off four of these, so that each snare has eight snares. Often too much snare sound results in the "fat" or "long" sound that we so detest.
Paul Milano
FMM 70-74
Although (making this longer), I don't know why it doesn't say to tune to a certain pitch. Because the heads are ever changing (bottom heads)? On step #4, it says that the step is very important. But I'm trying to figure out how to make sure that the head is absolutely balanced on the bearing edge. Do I just try to feel it out and try to figure out which way to push it or pull it to make it centered?
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#196683 - 11/06/09 11:16 AM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: DRUMS11]
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Registered: 09/07/09
Loc: Kansas City, MO
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Thanks alot DRUMS11, Ihave ssen that PDF before i just didnt know where to check the pitch on the head, and yeah on cranking up a 13" I was thinking about going D5 on the snare side with a Evans MX5 KevlarŪ head and taking the batter up to an F#5 with a MX white.
_________________________
RSHS Snare 2005-2007
RSHS instructor
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#196690 - 11/06/09 12:06 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Javier]
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User has negative Karma.
Registered: 10/13/08
Loc: alabama
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Update:
Just a little more info for whoever wants it...the BD that I work for showed me how he tunes his drums. He went to a couple Blue Devils clinics to learn what he knows. The batter head is tuned to a D, and the bottom head to a B (minor thirds, top head higher). Guts to a low pitch, so they don't get overtightened. The snares on my line are slightly bowed on either side, not just resting on the bottom head, to get a little more response. The guts are tightened just enough to get a response from the batter (top) head, maybe a little more but not overtightened. The BD is 51, and he's been a teacher for 17 years. I have to say for him not being a drummer, he has an excellent way of tuning drums. I hope this helps you guys out. Yeah really like the way blue devils snares sound. Can someone clarify what a minor 3rd is. So for the bottom head it's a B right and then you go up 3 halfsteps?... I think. So then it's C Flat, then it's C, then it's D Flat. Are those the 3 halfsteps? Then D is the pitch for the top head. Right? Any way basically the top will be a little higher than the bottom in the end. You go off of major scales. Say in C major E is a major 3rd from C, but if I lower the third from E to E flat it is now a minor third. So in this context he said B. So the B major scale is b, c#, d#, e, f#, g#, a#, and back to the tonic. So a major third from b would be d#. So we would lower this pitch a half step to d natural. So this is why d is a minor third from b. Major Scales c = c,d,e,f,g,a,b,c f = f,g,a,b flat,c,d,e,f b flat = b flat,c,d,e flat,f,g,a,b flat e flat = e flat,f,g,a flat,b flat,c,d,e flat a flat = a flat,b flat,c,d flat,e flat,f,g,a flat d flat = d flat,e flat,f,g flat,a flat,b flat,c,d flat g flat = g flat,a flat,b flat,c flat(b),d flat,e flat,f,g flat b = b,c sharp,d sharp,e,f sharp,g sharp, a sharp,b e = e,f sharp,g sharp,a,b,c sharp, d sharp,e a = a,b,c sharp,d,e,f sharp,g sharp,a d = d,e,f sharp,g,a,b,c sharp,d g = g,a,b,c,d,e,f sharp,g How to memorize these Well I put these in order of the circle of fourths(interval of the tonic, c to f, f to b flat, etc). As it went down the list I added one flat each time. The the next scale was the flat i added. The I reached the maximum amount of flats for major scales. Then I moved over to sharps. I started with all the sharps. Then i took one away each time. The one I took away was the next scale. Once I added or took something away it continued with that change. Order of flats, b,e,a,d,g,c,f. Oder of sharps, f,c,g,d,a,e,b. These are the same yet one is in reverse order depending on how you look at it. If anyone wants help in theory send me a message concerning what and I'll be glad to help.
Edited by pearldrumguy (11/06/09 12:09 PM)
_________________________
Innovative Sticks and Mallets
Pearl Drums and Percussion Equipment
Remo Drum Heads
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#198441 - 01/09/10 03:16 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: BDfan]
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Registered: 12/29/05
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While Star wasn't using KevlarŪ on top in '92, they were using Premier Marathon Mylar heads and cranking them pretty darn tight. I think they may have been using a Falam (KevlarŪ) head on the bottom. You don't need a free-floater for that kind of tension, but you still need a pretty sturdy drum. 12 lugs and cast rims might be a good rule of thumb. Or to be more specific, any of the following would work: Dynasty DFBL/DFS(T)/DFX(T) Ludwig Challenger Ludwig Vector Ludwig USA Free-Floater Mapex Quantum AT/HT/XT Pearl Championship (Pre-FFX) Pearl Championship FFX Premier HTS Remo Legato Yamaha Corps Custom MS-9014 Yamaha SFZ These would probably work, but I wouldn't guarantee the lugs will last forever under tension: Mapex Qualifier QLS-1412D Slingerland TDR Yamaha Field Corps MS-8014 Another Mylar line you might like is the 2002 Glassmen, who played Remo Powerstroke 77's on Pearl free-floaters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wF6YB0EoY1wThey switched to KevlarŪ mid-season, possibly because they might've gone through heads faster than Remo was willing to supply them.
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#207716 - 11/25/11 03:39 PM
Re: SNARE TUNING thread
[Re: Gonzo]
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![Tenure]()
Registered: 10/08/11
Loc: Philadelphia pa
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5. Tighten each tension rod with a spin key about one quarter turn, starting on the tension rod (lug) immediately to the left of front center (about 7 o'clock) and goi8ng around in a clockwise manner. This will be referred to as the "reference lug". Then check the spacing of the rim and the bearing edge again. Check the rim to avoid any "roller coaster" (rippled heads) effects early on. If you neglect this step, the head will already be unbalanced; this significantly shortens its life and allows only about half of its full cranking (tuning) capacity.
(bottom heads)?
I keep getting the roller coaster effect right where the snare beds are on my Yamaha SFZ..The head is under way less tension there. I can clearly see 4 points of tension but can seem to figure out how to spread that out evenly... Ive loosened it and started over a couple of times..using the suggested clockwise technique first.. started over used diagonal tech... but keep getting the same effect... What gives? Suggestions anyone? Thanks
Edited by locksRroots (11/25/11 04:11 PM)
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