After talking with a few Old School drummers on DLO I thought it would be cool to start a thread for some of the older DCI guy's and gal's to have a place to put some of their history, pictures and stories down for the new generation to have and learn from.

So, any of you Old Timers have any good stories or history that you want to share, please put it all down for everyone to read.

I just knew someone on here would set the record strait, so HM you have any more you want to share? After reading some of the posts in the history section, the info just didn't go with what I remember. But I wanted to give those who were there a chance to put the record strait so there was no body able to depute the topic with what they heard.

I remember the very next year in 1977 most drumlines were using 10 snares and 5 tenors to balance the sound. I know Blue Devils won DCI drums that year and only marched 9 snares. But 10 was becoming common as the next season 1978, SCV won drums with 10 snares. I did see Madison Scouts in 1974 with 9 snares at DCI Midwest and must have had problems they marched 8 at DCI finals. Execution was a major factor in winning drums at nationals.

Ok, keeping in the theme of history lessons I am placing a time line of drumline moments in time if any one finds any info incorrect please feel free to post a correction. I do not claim that any of the info is / are the correct event.


Drumline's Greatest Moment;
28,000 BC Invention of Percussion Prehistoric Man

1400’s Tympani are strapped to the backs of horses and are marched into battle

1500,s Swiss establish first three rudiments Swiss Triplets

1610 The first written drum march. It was not broken into bars, but had sounds written to indicate each note; pou-tou, Rpoung, etc. (the early version of drummers’ mouth music?) The special march was first played in Prince Harry’s presence.

1863 Congressional Medal of Honor awarded to a drummer of Company D, 3rd Vermont Volunteer Infantry. Willie Johnston

1947 inception of back sticking as wrist a devoloper

1955 First Use of Mallet instrument in Competition – Bugle Bells Madison Scouts

1957 First Use of Plastic Heads Cavaliers

1958 Spinning Cymbals Appleknockers

1959 USAF Drum corps introduced back sticking to the public

1960 Suspended Cymbals Boston Crusaders

1961 first manual for back sticking is written by John R. Dowlan( sold for .50 cents)

1961 First on field use of timbales Hawthorne Caballeros

1962 Introduced the first rudimental bass drum Blessed Sacrament Golden Knights

1965 First use of tuned bass drums Chicago Royal Airs
?Mitch Markovich - Cavaliers?

1965 Use of multiple pitch tenor drums St. Josephs Cadets

1967 Marching of two attached bass drums horizontally – in competition Boston Crusaders
Gerry Shellmer

1967 First marching tympani Ludwig, Boston Crusaders,
Boston Crusaders, Des Plaines Vanguard, SCV, St Joes, Madison Scouts, Royal Airs

1967 Marching Timbale/Bongo set Emerald Statesmen

1968 First triple bass Reading Buccaneers

1968 Development of the early double/triple toms Ludwig, Boston Crusaders, Des Plaines Vanguard, Anaheim Kingsmen, St Joes, Norwood Park Imperials, Reading Bucaneers
Jerry Shellmer, Glen Smith

1969 First mallet instrument carried in DCA competition Sunrisers

1969 Marching Cymbal Rack (5 cymbals) St. Lucy’s Cadets

1971/1972 First quad bass drums carried Yankee Rebels

1971 Fielding of 8 snare drums Blue Rock, Yankee Rebels

1973 First use of carriers/harnesses Santa Clara Vanguard

1973 Fielding of 9 snare drums St. Andrew Bridgeman

1974 Troopers drumline first to use " split snare parts and split rolls" in their solo "Yankee Doodle Dandy" now known as "B-Flat splits"

1974, 73 54 Consecutive high drum – regular season Santa Clara Vanguard

1974,1975 First back to back I&E snare solo winner ( 74=94.30/75=95.40 )Steve Chorazy, Santa Clara Vanguard

1975, 74, 73 Three consecutive Drum Titles Santa Clara Vanguard

1976 Fielding of 14 snare drums New York Skyliners

1976 Blue Devils win their first drum title(19.10) and again in 1977(18.80)

1977 First time the highest scoring drumline at Nationals didn’t go home with the trophy Oakland Crusaders

1977 First use of sep-toms – seven drums per rack Spirit of Atlanta

1977 First use of cut-away style tenors Santa Clara Vanguard,Oakland Crusaders, Slingerland


1977/1978 Kevlar®Æ drumhead created – Introduced in 1978 as Duraline Peter De Bear and Sam Muchnick

1978 World record for constant drum playing during a march – 20 miles Royal Crusaders

1978 First use of Quints Cavaliers

1978 Tom-Tom’s "iso-drums" mounted on the snare drums Boston Crusaders

1978 Fielding of 12 snare drums Phantom Regiment, 27th Lancers, Madison Scouts

1979, 78, 77 Three consecutive DCA drum titles Sunrisers

1979 The "DC10" stick is introduced Promark

1979 Bongos mounted on the snare drums Blue Devils

1980 Spirit – Bridgemen "tie" for drums – Bananas win when the GE sheets are added. DCI Birmingham, Al.

1980 Use of two tenor lines [high & low] four players each Santa Clara Vanguard

1981 North snares and tenors for first tour – tenors are tri toms – Spirits Line that year consisted of 12 snares, 7 tenors, and 7 basses Spirit of Atlanta

1981 "Hi Volume" snares from Ludwig – middle section of snare shell removed Guardsmen, Phantom Regiment, Marty Hurley

1982 Last use of sling in DCI Bayonne Bridgemen

1982, 81, 80 Three consecutive DCI drum titles Bayonne Bridgemen

1983 Blindfolded Snare Line performs Dennis Delucia’s "Black Market Juggler" Bayonne Bridgemen

1983 Full conga/bongo/timbale line instead of traditional snare/tenor lineup San Jose Raiders

1983 Use of Hi Hats From Sideline Spirit of Atlanta

1984 Three stick toss during solo Spirit of Atlanta

1984 Feature of marching xylophone solo Cadets

1985 25 sets of marching cymbals for feature Blue Devils

1985 Synthesizer used as a feature instrument in drum solo Boston Crusaders

1983-1986 DCI – Most Consecutive High Drum Trophy Wins (4) Blue Devils

1986 100 score in snare drum individuals at DCI Steven Campbell – Blue Devils

1987 Development of the first "Free Floating" snare drum PREMiER

I find this partial to various groups and instructors. If your corps dosen`t make finals you can`t possibly be the best drumline. I have witnessed other lines that won prelims and did not win finals it is a completely different event(different judges as well). So for the year 1977 the Blue Devils were DCI Drum caption winners and played a very difficult and exposed book that should have been rewarded more than what was given. Tom Float played the game with drumlines and was known as the "Water King" since he would take anything out of the book that was a tick or .1 mistake! His writing style was geared toward execution and sounded like check patterns to the music. He did not win GE Drums at all except when in 1986 they played the 1976 Channel One Suite Buddy Rich big band chart and his parts were not drum set sounding as the original but check patterns to music again! GE is more of a music effect score and check patterns are mechanical in sound. BD`s did not change a note all season! I was their snare tech!

Oh, I saw 1973 St Andrews Bridgemen and they were not clean, I think you should have given credit for a championship line not who threw a bunch of drums on the field. The Troopers beat them in drums by points!

In 1976 you give credit for a senior corps with 14 snares which I also witnessed and they were not clean at all. The BD`s in 1976 won drums at DCI and no mention is made and they did it with 10 snares. The first line with 10 snares to win DCI. I`d like to add that BD`s winning drums in 1977 DCI was also a first with 9 snare drums! Before the most snares in a DCI championship line was 8.

Ok, I was reading some of the older posts in the history catagory and I find no credible anwser to this question and since we have a few members that were around when this was implemented:

1. How did the high percussion award come about?

Nationals has always awarded a high caption award for Drums, Brass and M&M. They have just recently gave it the name Sanford to honor Fred for his work and his life. I remember when DCI first started Slingerland gave out the 1st place trophy for Corps. It was a TDR with a Trophy on top. I think they also gave the high drums but with no mention to any person.

O.k. there was a question about snare visuals and a part of the answer about backsticking was incorrect. I don't know about the part on the British starting backsticking in the 1700's. I can find no proof of this, maybe, maybe not. But the Skyliners were not the first to use backsticking. I am using John Dowlans manual as the reference for this since this is the first written manual (1961) for the subject. Now the first mention of backsticking that I can find is the mention of it being implemented in 1947 as a wrist conditioning exercise. The second time it is mentioned is in 1959, it was implemented by the USAF drum corps, not the Skyriders.
Now I tend to believe the information since Mr. Dowlan has been involved in our art of drumming since 1937 and an instructor for many of the early drum corps that have paved the way for us.
A bit of trivia on Mr. Dowlan... He was the national snare drum champion 6 times 1949,50,52 also 1959 and 1960. On the board of N.A.R.D. during his time and in the DCI hall of fame as one of the forefathers of DCI. His manual, 'Introduction to Backsticking', was published in 1961 and sold for the enormous price of $0.50, LOL! It is a small book of 8 pages and though the exercises are not that difficult compared to the backsticking of our age, it is nice to have for history's sake.
On the other originators of stick tricks I will leave to the ones who were there in the beginning, there are a few members who can answer this question "The History of Snare Visuals".

I do remember that chart well taken right from the album with Steve Gadd playing drum set on "My Spanish Heart". It even had orchestral ideas in some of the dynamic passages and the timing was not easy to execute. That line played a lot of notes that year they were really working for that show! One drum tape came back saying that Odello wrote one of his best pieces when it was Terry Shalbergs composition. He had a good laugh at that one. Shalberg was the center snare not Scott Johnson. The concert was called Spanish Fantasy!

Ok, can someone shed some light on these statements found in an old post on snare visuals?

(copied from another post) "I think you can look up Rich Viano for some balance tricks (on arm and on rim). Backsticking was invented in the 1700's by the British. It was introduced again in 1959 by the Skyliners I believe. Mickey Burmer invented the one stick pass roll. I think Mike Mcintosh invented some 3-stick stuff. Mark Casey invented the claw in the early 90's. I've heard rumors that Queen invented 3-way backsticking, but I'm not sure. That's all I can think of right now.

As of when they started being judges, the tricks were always being judged. Or at least as long as general effect and demand have been. They express your solo more and are often challenging."


I already talked about the back sticking info, but the 3-way back sticking has Queen as a possible originator, but in one of Scott Johnson's LOTW he claims to have been the originator for his snare line to use.

Anyone have the facts?

Why can`t Scott just tell us who showed it to him and we would know who invented it? Because I showed it to him and he seems to have memory problems in his old age. I was the snare tech for BD`s and Odello asked me to help the soloists for the 1977 season which I did help two snares Terry Shalberg and Scott both. I showed Johnson the backsticking and gave him a section out of my solo. I guess he can`t remember that and if the line tried using it for visuals it would have been in 1977 not 1976. He didn`t even know about it in 1976. Scott does take credit for other peoples ideas and I guess that has helped him become who he is. Why I no longer have any connection with that group.

Here is a post on the family tree of arrangers and instructors, but I mostly see the current guys and gal of this generation. Can one of the older members shed some light on the instructors before Hardimon ,Johnson, Delucia and others who now are our greats. Who were the guys who wrote and instructed them and were the influences for them?

Since this is the history lesson post lets get into some real history, even though the instructors that are talked about are history for most of the members on DLO now. But most of the dates mentioned 1980's - mid 90's that is not history to a lot of us, that was our time. (well, mine any way)

So really my question is to SCV75 and Hangman since they are the only ones who wish to share any history, and I know that SCV was instructing some of the names talked about in the fore-mentioned post.

Here is the link to the OP, go read it for yourselves, it does have some very good info from members that marched under the greats of today.

http://www.drumlines.org/threads/ubbthre....html#Post36835

From reading some of the posts in the History, Tom Float never taught Scott Johnson. Johnson aged out in 1979. Float was still teaching Atlanta until 1982 when he accepted the Blue Devil Job because they hadn`t won a drum title since 1977 and Scott begged to stay on as the tenor instructor after Float took over. Scott was the snare tech for BD`s during the years 1978-1981 when they placed no higher than 4th in 1978 in Drums at DCI.

In a post on "Family Tree of DCI Instructors" there was some confusion on the history of Dennis Delucia, I have enclosed some links of a interview with Dennis D. I was going to write some of the info that Dennis gives on his carrier but I feel that it would be a better choice to just post some links to the interview. There is too much great information that would be lost if I only put a short post on just the influences and corps that he has worked with. So enjoy the interview...



http://www.drumcorpsworld.com/articles.cfm?ID=671 interview with Dennis D. pt1
http://www.drumcorpsworld.com/articles.cfm?ID=686 pt2
http://www.drumcorpsworld.com/articles.cfm?ID=689 pt3
http://www.drumcorpsworld.com/articles.cfm?ID=714 History of the "Black Market Juggler"

Ken Mazur has posted on the history section and I notice many who don`t care for him! Could someone let me in on why Ken is so popular? I know he marched in Phantom and also won DCI snare in 1976. He has written some drum technique books along with some Rudimental Drumming history essays as well.

Well it depends on which Grip camp you are in, with my personal feeling aside, I find many traditional grip drummers do not care for his style and methods. On the other hand many Match grip drummers think that he is why God made sticks. He has on many times made the competitive solo community upset by some of his comments. His views are very controversial and obscure, so I will only say that you yourself will have to make your own decision on where you stand. Again I have my own opinion on Mr. Mazur and feel that I would not have the answer that most would deem objective.

He has posted many articles on the drumming world and the Industry of rudimental drumming and DCI, so with all that said I will post his article on "The Marching Music Industry Cult" and let those who read it make their own opinions on Mr. Mazur. By no means is this a bash on Mr. Mazur and I invite everyone to read all of his articles over on Rudimental Drumming.com. I only post this link to this article because this seems to be the contention of his popularity, the rest of his articles read very close to this one.

Read for yourself, it will answer your question...

http://www.rudimentaldrumming.com/The%20Marching%20Music%20Industry%20Cult.htm

Sounds like more banter about keeping marching pageantry in the olden times. Seems like he thinks all of the evolution that has occurred in the activity is in poor taste. I'm a youngin and although I don't agree with everything that is happening in show design trends and the evolution of the horn line (in DCI) I would never want percussion to jump back any amount of time.

He does sound like he is ready to storm a Post Office at any time. I know he won snare in 76 but if you look at who all was in I&E in 76 there was no one there to loose to any more.

Ya know carson set a I&E record... The only snare to win 2nd place 4 times. That must suck! I was at a drumline clinic where he came and gave a class, and I just don't see why Mazur won? I see what you are saying but Rob is much better than Mazur in my book!!!

I think Mazur played traditional style for snare so I can`t understand what you mean that matched grip tenor players like him! He also used a Premier Pipe Band snare for his solo. Very exposed drum to play rudimental style snare, you can hear everything. I think Carson used a Pipe Band Snare for his solo in 1978 and it was the all metal Brass snare that Alex Duthart also used around that time.

Sounds like he doesn`t like Larry McCormick or George Hopkins, McCormick was the Cavaliers Drum Instructor during the 1960`s and had won drums at Nationals many times. George was a snare drummer from the Crossmen and later became director of the Garfield Cadets.

IDK? but what I have seen he plays match grip like his buddy Rick and there are a bunch of matched grip, Rick B. lovers on the RUD.com site.

If he designs buildings like he plays, then I think I will stay out of any of his buildings,I'm just saying. He looks like he needs meds when he plays. Was he like that when he Marched?

I know that Rick Beckham plays matched grip and that he uses the names of Frank Arsenault and Mitch Markovich as authority figures on his site but they were traditional style snare soloists. Did anyone ever win DCI playing matched grip on snare? Buddy Rich and Steve Gadd use Traditional style and they are two of the best ever drum set players.

I did not know Ken when he was marching so your guess is as good as mine. I knew he taught Phantom Regiment as snare tech for a couple of years. And I think he did some judging in the Michigan area as well!

I just want to plug a very good thread that I highly recommend a second look.

THE HISTORY OF THE RUDIMENT


http://www.drumlines.org/threads/ubbthre...html#Post183970

This is a little involved but still can give a few answers. SCV was instructed by Fred Sanford and Bob Kalkofen in their early championship years in the 1970`s. Fred was the music arranger and Bob the Tech. Dennis Delucia studied with Bobby Thompson of Blessed Sacrament fame as a high school student. Both Tom Float and Ralph Hardimon had many influences with the Kingsmen including Don Porter, Edward Bostwick(Troopers), Jerry Kirby(Kilties) and then Float went to Freelancers and studied with Don Silva who was originally from the Capitalairs in Sacramento who evolved into the Freelancers. Ralph was a good friend of Fred Sanford and taught the Alberta All Girl corps in the mid 1970`s and then became SCV caption head with Jerry Kirby in 1976. Thomm Hannum was in Crossmen and was instructed by Erik Landis and Bill Kaufman during the 1970`s and later went on to teach the Cadets and Star in the 1980`s. I did the winter tech program with Crossmen in 1978-79 and had many name players in that line including Mark Thuston, Robbie Robinson, Steve Kieffer(Cadets Bass tech) and Chris Thompson was the tenor tech with Hannum the arranger for Crossmen. By 1980 Crossmen were beating SCV and BD`s in drums. Chris went on to teach/write for Madison Scouts in the late 1980`s.

I`m trying to add information in as I go since it is more complex in certain situations like Delucia taught Hawthorne Muchachos in 1970-1975 and then Bridgemen 1976-1984 before also working with Star, he also played in the Hell Cats at West Point. Float marched with the Lynwood Diplomats and Ralph was in Velvet Knights(Forest Clark, Bob Buck) before playing in the Kingsmen. The Troopers were a major influence on the California corps as Sanford worked with Kingsmen in 1966&1967 while going to college at Fullerton State University. Ed Bostwick a Trooper snare also went to college in that area and instructed Kingsmen. Ralph and Float joined Kingsmen in 1971 when they had 5 snares the year before they won DCI drums in 1972.

When I was in the Troopers(1973-74) Jim Jones hired Kalkofen to work the winter tech program and Jones was writing most of the drum book. Jones also brought in Joe Marrella from Blue Rock(1971) Fame to fine tune the line and is where I learned a few concepts for getting lines tight and playing well together as an ensemble. Joe gives much credit to his teacher John Dowlan while in the Vasella Musketters from Philadelphia. John Dowlan was a 3 time VFW snare champion with the Reilly Raiders.

I taught the Blue Devils the first two DCI drum titles in 1976&1977 and had Scott Johnson playing in that line. They were a very good drum line for two years and had already beaten SCV in drums during the 1975 season with Rick Odello instructing. The problem was getting over the top and winning at DCI finals which we did. Tom Float later taught the BD`s from 1982-1990 and and won 4 DCI drum titles.

Robbie Robinson went on to teach the Bushwackers DCA drum titles, Mark Thurston was drum instructor for Crossmen from the mid 1980`s-1996 and also was the originator of the WGI indoor lines and contests. Hannum went to Cadets and Star after Crossmen and Chris Thompson later went to Madison. Steve Kieffer was Bass tech for Hannum at Cadets and is still involved with them as a consultant.

From this evolved many of the drum instructors for todays DCI and DCA lines.

Ok now who done what and who is who??JK!

It's great to have a member who was there during the early evolution of our craft. Seem like people need to go back and investigate the influences of the instructors most hold on high. I marched from 79 to 84 and I can certainly remember some of those people mentioned in your post "75" and the scv line was a big favorite of mine ever since your days "The Clock". Thanks to guys like your self helping to mold the future instructors of today! Look at the Cadets Bass line 2011. That has got to be the best Bass line that I have ever heard in decades! And Scott Johnson, look at the devils now carrying on a tradition and a legacy that you yourself help establish! I've have copies of your early writing and I have a small grasp of your theory and method and can see your influence in his (Scott Johson) writing today.

We as drummers owe the past instructors a huge amount of gratitude and respect for the early developments of rudimental drumming!